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Bugs found in Dragon Quest RPG

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Post by DZ October 29th 2012, 3:29 pm

So decided to play through the newer version of Dragon Quest RPG yesterday, you've definitely improved a lot, but still many bugs remain, some old, some new, some just plain bad balancing. I'll start with the obvious ones first, then go down the list. Warning, this list is a bit exhaustive:

1. The ability that is supposed to give energy when you take damage fails sometimes, making you lose energy instead.
2. Talent numbers don't seem to line up too well, is supposed to be talent count = level, correct? At level 90 I had 89 talents only somehow.
3. Talent tree allowed more points then intended, it let me blow 11 points in many fields, especially the melee line that leads down to vampiric tendencies.
4. Death actor for the impetus(archon) is clearly wrong, dies as an overlord? And why do the undead always die in flames, is this supposed to be a vampire death effect, or something overlooked?
5. Muta/Hydra don't seem to have death actors at all, and random demonic sheep/wolves didn't have death actors. Hydra seemed to have a muta death sound as well?
6. Demonic armor gave me some weird aura, no idea what that was about, some description on the armor would be nice.
7. Unit damage RARELY matched up with the actual damage the units did, was useless to look at.
8. Potion stacks never saved properly, would take a stack of 30 grand health potions and make it just 1 grand health potion when I came back. Same for any other potions. This especially hurts for potions you can't buy, you have to kill for.
9. The caster/templar guy in the guardians boss section is marked as 'heroic', making effects do far less damage to him. Speaking of them, they are spelled guardians, not gaurdians or however the map has it, lol.
10. Why does the light series of armor suddenly stop, I often find the boost in speed more useful than the armor.
11. Armor/weapon costs do not line up one bit, Weapons stop at like 400k (2 to whatever power), while armor seems to stop at 4 million. Not that the best armor helps much, 30 armor does diddly crap against the endgame.
12. Final boss First Form/Second Form has same hp/shields w/ 1 player as he does w/ 4 players. This is fine, but all your other bosses do not follow this model, their hps scale w/ initial player count.
13. Speaking of scaling, the scaling should be dynamic, IE 2 players leave, boss 4 (the walker thing) should not still have 400k hps or whatever ridiculous amount you gave him. Boss 3 proves more difficult than boss 4 as well due to boss 3 not allowing regen due to constant hits.
14. The game allows melees to do quite well, up until you reach the final boss, where you get 2 or 3 hit killed no problem. Whereas a magic user can do well throughout the entire game played right. I realize balancing between melee/magic is a hard thing, but surely we can do a little better than 2 shotting melees. This is made even worse by the fact potions have a long cooldown, yet I can't seem to get rid of energy fast enough with the right talents. Majorly imbalanced at the moment.
15. Final Boss Phase 2 does not reset properly, when you come back the usual effects aren't there, the vision you normally have is non existent.
16. Inferno has no attack response, it is quite possible to inferno anything to death if you are patient enough, including the final boss, with no retaliation at all.
17. Weapon levels are severely wack, you can EASILY get enough money for the Godly Claws at level 50-60ish, yet they require 100?
18. Speaking of easy money, the economy is better than it was, only issue is, there is now too much money instead of too little as it was in the past. Once you start hunting the immortals and such, minerals are never a problem ever again.
19. Attack Waves before zauberer do not seem to scale at all as the areas before them do.
20. Would it be a huge issue to allow bosses to respawn after say a few minutes? Given the fact some of them drop rare loot that some might want, this would be beneficial to those wishing to farm them without chain making games all day.
21. Speed potions and Health potions have too long of delays. Speed potion should have no delay at all really, just have the potion remove any old potion buffs each time it is used. Health potions I can understand having some delay, but 30 seconds? Talk about favoring magic classes here, 3-5 seconds be a lot more reasonable for making melee playable end game.
22. Town Portal just plain does not work for me. Should be noted I never use checkpoints either, I don't die often, and when I do it always just starts me off in the boss area anyways.
23. End game (Zauberer) Area locks you in after you get so far, there is no way to go back to town to get more potions or whatever.
24. Attack animations do not play on 1 shot melee kills, I'm guessing you have a backswing/damage point of 0 here that causes this. Adding a tiny value like 0.1 would fix this.
25. Inferno/Flameclaws never loads right, always have to repurchase them every game.
26. Terrain has many little flaws around cliff edges, and there are mysterious patches of water in many locations as well.

All I could think of from playing through yesterday, hoping you take a look at these issues.
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Post by Deathbringer October 29th 2012, 4:40 pm

Thanks for your post. There are some things that I cannot fix, at least without serious work.

Example: Potions originally couldn't be stacked at all, and there was no system in place to allow them to stack before SC update 1.5. Now there is a system in place for potion stacks and stuff, but the problem is Blizzard forgot to make it so stack count is saved with the items in the bank.

There are more things that I have little control over, but I am actually going to take a look at these right now.
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Post by Greed October 29th 2012, 4:45 pm

DZ wrote:So decided to play through the newer version of Dragon Quest RPG yesterday, you've definitely improved a lot, but still many bugs remain, some old, some new, some just plain bad balancing. I'll start with the obvious ones first, then go down the list. Warning, this list is a bit exhaustive:

1. The ability that is supposed to give energy when you take damage fails sometimes, making you lose energy instead.
2. Talent numbers don't seem to line up too well, is supposed to be talent count = level, correct? At level 90 I had 89 talents only somehow.
3. Talent tree allowed more points then intended, it let me blow 11 points in many fields, especially the melee line that leads down to vampiric tendencies.
4. Death actor for the impetus(archon) is clearly wrong, dies as an overlord? And why do the undead always die in flames, is this supposed to be a vampire death effect, or something overlooked?
5. Muta/Hydra don't seem to have death actors at all, and random demonic sheep/wolves didn't have death actors. Hydra seemed to have a muta death sound as well?
6. Demonic armor gave me some weird aura, no idea what that was about, some description on the armor would be nice.
7. Unit damage RARELY matched up with the actual damage the units did, was useless to look at.
8. Potion stacks never saved properly, would take a stack of 30 grand health potions and make it just 1 grand health potion when I came back. Same for any other potions. This especially hurts for potions you can't buy, you have to kill for.
9. The caster/templar guy in the guardians boss section is marked as 'heroic', making effects do far less damage to him. Speaking of them, they are spelled guardians, not gaurdians or however the map has it, lol.
10. Why does the light series of armor suddenly stop, I often find the boost in speed more useful than the armor.
11. Armor/weapon costs do not line up one bit, Weapons stop at like 400k (2 to whatever power), while armor seems to stop at 4 million. Not that the best armor helps much, 30 armor does diddly crap against the endgame.
12. Final boss First Form/Second Form has same hp/shields w/ 1 player as he does w/ 4 players. This is fine, but all your other bosses do not follow this model, their hps scale w/ initial player count.
13. Speaking of scaling, the scaling should be dynamic, IE 2 players leave, boss 4 (the walker thing) should not still have 400k hps or whatever ridiculous amount you gave him. Boss 3 proves more difficult than boss 4 as well due to boss 3 not allowing regen due to constant hits.
14. The game allows melees to do quite well, up until you reach the final boss, where you get 2 or 3 hit killed no problem. Whereas a magic user can do well throughout the entire game played right. I realize balancing between melee/magic is a hard thing, but surely we can do a little better than 2 shotting melees. This is made even worse by the fact potions have a long cooldown, yet I can't seem to get rid of energy fast enough with the right talents. Majorly imbalanced at the moment.
15. Final Boss Phase 2 does not reset properly, when you come back the usual effects aren't there, the vision you normally have is non existent.
16. Inferno has no attack response, it is quite possible to inferno anything to death if you are patient enough, including the final boss, with no retaliation at all.
17. Weapon levels are severely wack, you can EASILY get enough money for the Godly Claws at level 50-60ish, yet they require 100?
18. Speaking of easy money, the economy is better than it was, only issue is, there is now too much money instead of too little as it was in the past. Once you start hunting the immortals and such, minerals are never a problem ever again.
19. Attack Waves before zauberer do not seem to scale at all as the areas before them do.
20. Would it be a huge issue to allow bosses to respawn after say a few minutes? Given the fact some of them drop rare loot that some might want, this would be beneficial to those wishing to farm them without chain making games all day.
21. Speed potions and Health potions have too long of delays. Speed potion should have no delay at all really, just have the potion remove any old potion buffs each time it is used. Health potions I can understand having some delay, but 30 seconds? Talk about favoring magic classes here, 3-5 seconds be a lot more reasonable for making melee playable end game.
22. Town Portal just plain does not work for me. Should be noted I never use checkpoints either, I don't die often, and when I do it always just starts me off in the boss area anyways.
23. End game (Zauberer) Area locks you in after you get so far, there is no way to go back to town to get more potions or whatever.
24. Attack animations do not play on 1 shot melee kills, I'm guessing you have a backswing/damage point of 0 here that causes this. Adding a tiny value like 0.1 would fix this.
25. Inferno/Flameclaws never loads right, always have to repurchase them every game.
26. Terrain has many little flaws around cliff edges, and there are mysterious patches of water in many locations as well.

All I could think of from playing through yesterday, hoping you take a look at these issues.

Before i begin i would just like to say thank you for playing and somehow finding 26 bugs/balance issues. I will try go through most of them. I wonder if you could perhaps make a forum account here.

1. If you try to '-reset talents' this will generally fix a lot of talent bugs.
2. It bugs when you double level or evolve. If you reset your talents it should fix it.
3. The 11 points it gives, is actually a bug prevention. You don't actually get the 11th point in it but there was a point in time where we had to set talents each game. At first most people were getting 11 points without the bonus but losing the point. It has since been changed that getting the 11th point gives nothing and wont even remove a point from your available points. Example. i have apparently used 11 in each talent i use except the Vampiric Tendencies
4. Game is a beta still...... what do you expect?? No idea why myself either but i find it funny. Smile
5. Have not noticed this but I'm sure Hero will try fix it unless he has it like this for some reason...... Personally i want this Island of Woe to appear to me first.
6. The aura from the demonic armor is meant to be there. It is the only armor everyone can obtain that actually have the aura for the moment. Descriptions I'm sure will come soon, but Hero prioritizes new content and bug fixes over text errors and item descriptions
7. I will not comment on this
8.Current bug that is being worked on.
9. The caster from the 25 boss area? He is the leader of the 3. Thus boss.
10. Good question. I myself prefer the movement of light cloth over ascended, but i think it came to a point where people didn't seem to notice. 100 agility might of had something to do with that.
11. The shops do need some work........ As for armor, its percentage based reduction. If you have 10 armor you take 10% less damage. If you have 30 armor, you take 30% less damage
12. I am pretty sure he is designed that way. More units spawn though which can easily cause you to lose to the boss, even if he alone cant 1 shot you.
13. I will not comment on this
14. I will not comment on this
15. Being fixed in next patch i believe.
16. That is a pretty big bug if understand what you are saying. That will be looked at right away.
17. This falls under weapon balance and shop balance. I am pretty sure nearly everything is going to be gone over with a fine tooth comb soon to find things like this.
18. I would think that when all the items get balanced along with shop the minerals given on death will be balanced as well.
19. Bio Dome is a completely separate part of the map. The rules so to speak are different there.
20. We are planning to allow the 1st boss to respawn i believe, but you must remember, boss's give a lot of experience. If we let them all respawn it will just be constant farming bosses instead of all the creeps.
21. It is not a delay, It is the duration of the potion. Does need to be fixed. As to health potions it was set like that for a reason, but i cant recall what reason it was.
22. Town Portal can only be used in certain areas. It isn't meant to be an item for level 50s-100 but meant to be an item for lower level to use should they come close to dying.
23. It's a trap!
24. This is Hero's project. The forum admins are given an item for their time, and we help people with bank files and in game. We don't actually have access to the direct game though. I am sure when Hero reads this, if this is indeed the problem, it will be fixed on next patch.
25. It has something to do with the bank file limits set in place by blizzard unfortunately.
26. I will not comment on this.
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Post by DZ October 29th 2012, 5:08 pm

Good you are actively watching this thread, some of the bugs are indeed design decisions, which is understandable. Again let me say the map has progressed a lot since I saw it 6-8 months ago, I enjoy messing around on it when I'm avoiding my own project. It seems most of what you saw doesn't need to be said again, but would like to discuss potions a little more.

The haste potion delay is understandable, IF the haste effect persisted through death. However since it doesn't, causes some issues for those wanting to keep hasted.

The stacking potion issue is one I know well, I had to put in some interesting stuff to make it work on my project as well. I am DeadZergling by the way(thus the DZ), I have been working on Horologium RPG over at sc2mapster, this map was one of the RPGs I played to see what RPGs were doing in SC2, see what I could accomplish, etceteras. I was able to come up with something that works for my project to always save potion counts if you or Hero wanted to see it, but is fine if he would prefer to do it himself. It doesn't really let you know how many are in a stack per se, but it does let you know how many charges are used in the stack.

Do what you want w/ the feedback anyways, just thought I'd bring the stuff I saw up.


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Post by EternalToss October 29th 2012, 5:39 pm

Since greed didnt want to bring up #13, #14, and #26 i will, first of I'd like to state im not a coder so i really dont know the workings/problems with coding any of the fixes/changes for sure, but none the less i have my opinions and base knowledge. As for the boss hp the final boss is designed to be difficult no matter what level and prestige you are so the hp doesnt scale with the number of players. Also i believe that problems could come up with scaling hp by the amount of players that have left the game especially if you're in the process of fighting one.

#14 I find that melee dragons are actually very easy to work with ive personally made my own builds scaling the difference between vit/dex/str as i go and it works out fine (this is also without my Mod Armor and even before prestiging) so it should be no problem at all with the proper build to solo anything. I would also happily prove this by resetting my prestiges and just using ascended armor and godly claws. About the potions yes its a long cooldown, but the problem was that people of lower levels could kill higher tier bosses by just spamming potions and with them stacking now even if they buy new ones every game they could easily solo if there wasn't a cooldown although i agree that it could be shortend a bit.

#26 again im not a coder so i dont know anything about making terrain or anything, but i dont see what is wrong with the cliffs exactly >.> and all water was done on purpose and tbh it's better than any other terrain ive seen.

Just a side note you probably noticed i didn't comment on #7 either because ive never really even looked at the damage done by units i just ran in and saw for myself.
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Post by Deathbringer October 29th 2012, 6:31 pm

#7 Damage units do against an enemy with 0 armor and no unit type is of course going to be different than damage done to a heroic with armor.
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Post by DZ October 29th 2012, 7:22 pm

@EternalToss

I agree with you that melee is easy to work with, save against the final boss where I found myself getting 2 or 3 hitted and dead. Ended up just dumping everything into vitality/int, using all large orbs of healing/ascended armor, was able to beat them around level 80ish that way. Found it easier to just not use any weapon at all as well to prevent my dragon from going too close to zauberer, lol. Was like 1200 hp and 300ish int.

Haven't tried doing it with godly claws yet, have to get my dragon to that point(level 100) and try. Believe my melee build was like 1000-1200 hp, 200 str, enough dex (like 73) to get -.4 delay w/o haste potion, 30-40 agi, any extra dumped into str/sta. Using vampiric tendencies too obviously.

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Post by EternalToss October 29th 2012, 7:40 pm

its still possible and the final boss is designed really for high tier levels so its no fun if theres no struggles.
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Post by shade October 29th 2012, 7:52 pm

id just like to put my input about the finale boss being a 13th prestiger because of the glich, ive killed the finale boos a milllion times even when i only had one prestige and before, all you have to do is have the vamp 900 health 100ish (depending if you have prestiged or not) dex and rest in str with a grand speed potion and oblivian claws and you could kill him with an extra noob or two with only one or none prestiges.... i think he should be more powerful but thats just cause i found a really good strat
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Post by EternalToss October 29th 2012, 9:45 pm

you can do it without potions though ive done it lol
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Post by shade October 29th 2012, 9:57 pm

well yeah i have to its just nice to have one to kill him faster lol
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Post by Deathbringer October 30th 2012, 11:05 am

To the OP I would love to take a look at how you managed to save stack counts for items, but keep in mind that I have already reached a point where my bank files are pretty big.
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Bugs found in Dragon Quest RPG Empty How to save Charges

Post by DZ October 30th 2012, 4:14 pm

Well first of all I wouldn't worry too much about your bank size, since they have recently upped the bank size limit per player to 1 MB. Although I'm a little skeptical myself, been keeping my banks pretty nice and tidy, about 1.7 kb a piece. Anyways, about how I do save the charges, I'll do my best to translate it from what I have in my project to something you can use. Keep in mind I haven't played with it in 4-5 months, so may need to ask me to clarify some:

First of all, my inventory consists of 80 slots total that can possibly hold a potion/charged item, so I use an array size 80 of ints to store my charges. Believe I called this chargesUsed or something like that, I'll refer to it as chargesUsed for the duration of this post.

Second, every time a hero does anything inventory related, moves an item, sells an item, buys an item, etc, this array gets repopulated. To the end of this array getting repopulated, my items have a certain system that can check whether or not it is a potion/scroll type, your triggers might end up having to look uglier than this, as you'd have to see if it was one of your haste potions, a town portal, or healing potion, doing several string checks. Could always revise the names of them I suppose to be easier to track, but that's up to you, mine simply have (Tonic) before them in name for simplicity.

So if it is an item that could have charges/an item is in fact there, the idea is to simply record how many charges are used. Unfortunately, it isn't quite so simple, as the data side wants the specific charge type in order to be able to grab this, to this end, I have a helper function just to get the charge name for me, lol.

string gf_CharginatorHelper (string lp_search) {
// Implementation
if(lp_search == "TonicMinorHeal")
{
return "Item/TonicMinorHeal";
}
else if(lp_search == "TonicLesserHeal")
{
return "Item/TonicLesserHeal";
}
else if(lp_search == "TonicMinorMana")
{
return "Item/TonicMinorMana";
}
else if(lp_search == "TonicLesserMana")
{
return "Item/TonicLesserMana";
}
return "";
}

So now we have our charge type based on the item, I think you'll end up having 9 types maybe? I recall seeing 4 health, 4 haste, and 1 town portal potions in your map. Using this charge, you'll use a combination of functions to get the actual charges used. I'm not at the editor, don't recall the gui version of this, but the script is something like this:

lv_charge = FixedToInt(UnitGetChargeUsed(gv_inventory[lp_p].lv_potion[0][lv_i], lv_search));

lv_charge is just a temp variable I use for the function getting the charges, FixedToInt is obviously converting a Real to Integer, or floating point or decimal type or whatever you like to call them. UnitGetChargeUsed() is a built in blizzard function, if you go to scary data mode (Data only view) it should show up somewhere under units. gv_inventory[lp_p].lv_potion[0][lv_i] is simply the inventory slot/item im looking at, yours will look something quite different. lv_search is what I used gf_CharginatorHelper() for, it is the charge type.

Okay so that is how we populate our chargesUsed[80] array, clear as mud I know, please let me know what I need to clarify. There is more explanation to go if you want to know how I save it to a bank, how I load it from a bank, but in a nutshell I save a big ugly string in array order, then load it the same way. Takes about 100-150 bytes probably. Hope this helps a little, it is unfortunately a pain in the ass workaround though.

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Post by Deathbringer October 30th 2012, 6:34 pm

So if this is saving the charges used than how do you know how many they had to begin with? Or does this detect and save the number of charges they have?
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Post by DZ October 30th 2012, 6:44 pm

It doesn't let you actually know how many charges you have, it does however allow you to find how many charges have been used. So if your stack goes to say 20, and you have 17 charges used, you have 3 charges left. Why I have an array of chargesUsed, not chargesLeft.
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Post by Deathbringer October 30th 2012, 11:00 pm

I'm not sure you understand that potions and stuff are picked up. So if they used 30 potions, it doesn't tell me if they have 70, 50, 23, etc... potions left.
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Post by EternalToss October 31st 2012, 12:02 am

Can't you just have it so every time you gain a potion it checks you bank files for the original quantity of potions and then have it track the loss/gain of potions from that point on?
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Post by Deathbringer October 31st 2012, 12:42 am

But you don't pick up potions with max stack. You pick up potions 1 by 1. So if someone only had 5 potions and used 5, with your system it would give them 94 because the max stack count is 99.
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Post by DZ October 31st 2012, 7:34 am

I'm going to guess that the way potions are set up on the data side of things in the item field for any particular potion is looking something like this:

(Using Table View)
......
Basic: Charge-
Basic: Count (Max) 99
Basic: Count (Start) 1
Basic: Count (Use) 1
......

With the main important parts being the Max and Start values. If you have a Max value of 99, and buy 1 potion, you basically have a 99 pack w/ 98 used. When you buy a second, it auto stacks, making it a 99 pack w/ 97 used. I find it highly unlikely that we are using different items all together.

Just try it, grab the used value of say a stack of 20 potions in the map, I bet you get 79 back. I do know this works flawlessly on my map, the only difference is I start my potions at 20/20, and alter the value down if I need to (so a monster can drop say 2 or 3 charges or whatever). There is no reason that should make a difference.

It would be helpful to see the XML of a potion item or two if for some reason this isn't as I am thinking it will be. I'm almost 100 % certain though that it will work this way.

In hindsight on MY project I might go ahead and alter mine to 1/20, make potions far cheaper for users to buy since I was forcing them to pay for a 20 pack, lol. Easy fix, take a whole minute, but didn't think to do it until just now Smile
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Post by DZ October 31st 2012, 10:36 am

So apparently changing the potion initial count from 1 to 20 makes loading/saving a little more complicated, but still very much doable. Took me awhile to reconfigure my triggers to make it work, but did finally get it to. Main tricks I noticed are you have to update chargeUsed array periodically (I just lumped it in right before my periodic save), as buying potions a bunch triggers the item used event the first potion, but it ignores the potions bought that get stacked for some reason. Other trick is you have to clear charges used at the start. This might not be necessary for your map, but since my stacks go to 20, and it is quite often that youll have a few stacks of the same thing, it is an important step as otherwise 3 stacks of potions turns into only 1 stack of 3 potions (yuck!). You will need to do something similar if you want to account for the possibility of multiple stacks of the same type of potion.

Thought I'd show a video of it in action, excuse the ugliness, my project is still in alpha Smile

youtube.com/watch?v=pGdovLQRe7U&feature=youtu.be
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Post by Deathbringer October 31st 2012, 10:51 am

Found a better way. Everytime you pick up an item, it detects if it is a potion. If it is, then you add 1 to the count for that item. Than you just give the hero that number of potions when the game starts. It will automatically sort them into the stack that they should go in.
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Bugs found in Dragon Quest RPG Empty Re: Bugs found in Dragon Quest RPG

Post by DZ October 31st 2012, 2:10 pm

Aye that works fine too as long as you keep track of potions at any time they might be used. Just be careful with that on load, if you are doing it the way I think you are, could potentially have 200-300 potions counted up that way, could cause serious lag/disconnects on load.

You are saying just store the potion count then creating that number of potions upon start in a loop correct? It will probably work fine, I'm probably just being anal about using no more processing than absolutely necessary. Hope it works out Smile
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Post by Deathbringer October 31st 2012, 3:11 pm

I just threw it in with my other item management trigger that saves all your items in a array for when you evolve. This will just keep another 3d array[Player Num][Stack Item Index] that increments by 1 whenever you get a potion in some way and decrement whenever you lose a potion in some way.
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Post by Deathbringer October 31st 2012, 3:26 pm

nevermind. Doesn't work because it doesn't even consider it as adding a new item when you buy an item that stacks.
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Bugs found in Dragon Quest RPG Empty Re: Bugs found in Dragon Quest RPG

Post by DZ October 31st 2012, 3:58 pm

Right, that's what I was referring to earlier w/ my earlier post:

Main tricks I noticed are you have to update chargeUsed array periodically (I just lumped it in right before my periodic save), as buying potions a bunch triggers the item used event the first potion, but it ignores the potions bought that get stacked for some reason

You should be able to periodically check your inventory however (is how I got around this), maybe lump it in with your save. Simply look at each slot to see if it is a potion, if it is find the charges used and set your potion variable to 99 - chargesUsed, and save that?
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